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Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 3:35 pm**

steve wrote:
Bernardo wrote:
steve wrote:someone who only likes rock music and only because it is rock music.

Not as rare as you´d think.

Okay, name a couple. I can't think of anyone.

Chuck Berry wrote:Just let me hear some of that rock'n'roll music
Any old way you choose it
It's got a backbeat, you can't lose it
Any old time you use it
It's gotta be rock - roll music
If you wanna dance with me
If you wanna dance with me

I have no kick against modern jazz
Unless they try to play it too darn fast
And change the beauty of the melody
Until it sounds just like a symphony
That's why I go for that rock'n'roll music
Any old way you choose it
It's got a backbeat, you can't lose it
Any old time you use it
It's gotta be rock - roll music
If you wanna dance with me
If you wanna dance with me

I took my loved one over 'cross the tracks
So she could her my man a - whalin' sax
I must admit they have a rockin' band
Man they were goin' like a hurricane
That's why I go for that rock'n'roll music
Any old way you choose it
It's got a backbeat, you can't lose it
Any old time you use it
It's gotta be rock - roll music
If you wanna dance with me
If you wanna dance with me

Way down South they gave a jubilee
Them country folks they had a jamboree
They're drinkin' homebrew from a wooden cup
The folks dancin' got all shook up
And started playin' that rock'n'roll music
Any old way you choose it
It's got a backbeat, you can't lose it
Any old time you use it
It's gotta be rock - roll music
If you wanna dance with me
If you wanna dance with me

Don't care to hear 'em play the tango
I'm in no mood to dig a mambo
It's way too early for the congo
So keep a - rockin' that piano
So I can hear some of that rock'n'roll music
any old way you choose it
It's got a backbeat, you can't lose it
Any old time you use it
It's gotta be rock - roll music
If you wanna dance with me
If you wanna dance with me

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 3:59 pm**

tocharian wrote:
I’m not gonna sit here and re-write Susan Sontag’s “Notes on Camp” but I will say this:

Newsflash: ROCK AND ROLL IS KITSCH!

No need to re-write, just tell us how do you define "kitsch" and "rock and roll". (Yes, I did read the entire thread)

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:12 pm**

wow, tocharian, you pulled this out just fast enough to still win asshat of 2007. congrat's.

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:18 pm**

tocharian wrote:Listen, I like rock music. I don't think it's art.

This statement really angers me. Anything can be art. I don't want to hear you play the oboe, but it is most certainly art. I could throw my poop at a wall and you bet your ass it's art.

You sound like one of those people who might pull controversial pieces from the walls of museums based on your definition of art. I know that seems extreme, but that's how it starts.

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:30 pm**

tocharian wrote:
I’m not gonna sit here and re-write Susan Sontag’s “Notes on Camp” but I will say this:

Newsflash: ROCK AND ROLL IS KITSCH!

No.
In fact the great rock is probably the opposite of kitsch ie it demands not to be taken seriously, but it should be taken seriously.
I can't believe this discussion came about defending such a crappy band.

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:41 pm**

steve wrote:While this is a made-up word and can probably mean whatever you want it to mean, I still think this is nonsense, that I am somehow "rockist." This term seems to have been made up to create a fictional enemy of broad taste, someone who only likes rock music and only because it is rock music. To rail against this non-existent class, it needed a name, and the name chosen was "rockist."

Anyone who thinks I belong in this class, even "somewhat," ought to be able to explain both what the term means, and why it applies to me.

Please have at it.

"Rockism" is the attitude that rock is the most recent incarnation of the ancient, venerable folk tradition, ie. the "music of the people," as sort of the de-facto standard state of music. It often tends to imply that other forms are either watered-down perversions of this tradition or pretentious academic constructions based upon it. The general upshot is that this musical tradition has survived because of its sincerity, expressive strength and public appeal. Thus, rockism celebrates not only rock music, but blues, folk, country, jazz and other forms that fit into the same format of small ensembles paying popular, secular music for the entertainment of the general public.

Steve, I didn't openly accuse you of espousing this view and I don't know enough about your personal taste in music to be sure, but your dismissive attitude towards recent electronically generated/composed music might understandably be perceived by some as "rockist."

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 5:51 pm**

Colonel Panic wrote:Steve, I didn't openly accuse you of espousing this view and I don't know enough about your personal taste in music to be sure, but your dismissive attitude towards recent electronically generated/composed music might understandably be perceived by some as "rockist."

I go to some lengths to explain myself and my critical thinking. This and the open admiration I have for such a wide spectrum of music (only a small portion of it being inarguably "rock" music) ought to make it clear that my distaste for some music is based on the music itself -- "music" being broadly defined to include everything associated with the sound under discussion.

I would still like to see an example of this species, a genuine "rockist." They appear to be as imaginary as unicorns.

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:02 pm**

I like to think of myself as the "rockingist".

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:14 pm**

best thread ever

Posted: **Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:15 pm**

tocharian wrote:
ROCK AND ROLL IS KITSCH!

This was awesome.

But as usual, I missed the moment. Just like Lounge Ax.

Damnit.

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