The 2004 documentary by Ondi Timoner about the Brian Jonestown Massacre and the Dandy Warhols.

I watched way back then and remember it being one of the best and funniest documentaries I've seen. Watched it again a couple of weeks ago, and yep, still holds up. Not crap... FROM OTHER PEOPLE'S FACES!

One of the couple things that I changed my mind was Anton's parents. While I don't know how bad things went in Anton's home when he was a kid orhow much blame did each of the parents deserve, but I now feel really sad for Anton's dad. The dad, who was schizophrenic, knew he fucked up and knew that he was virtually incapable of helping at that point. I might have felt sympathy for the mom back then, but I just rewatched that little bit on the movie, holy shit, she not only given up on Anton but she turned her own son to the police after she discovered that he was growing marijuana. At first, I thought she was mainly a victim of the war on drugs hysteria, but she was clearly a horrible mother. Zero reflection on any fuckups.

Also, I'm listening ...The Dandy Warhols Come Down. I'm surprised that I like a couple of songs on the album, namely "Be-In" being the highlight. But damn, when the songs get stupid, they get stupid. Anton was right about "Minnesoter" being one of those songs. Shit use of a Jew's harp = crap.

Highly entertaining in a Some Kind of Monster way.

I would have hated all of these people if I ran into them on tour (not that it was likely).

I especially hate how the doc paints Anton as this super genius when he's having an overdub fest in the studio. I just saw a similar thing on Jay Bennett, like "He'd stay up all night with all of these keyboards, timpanis. He was so special." Like, do you know how many multi instrumentalists have had their Brian Wilson moment? Enough for Fred Armisen to make a sketch about it.

I enjoy it everytime I watch. With the Dandies It does really hit home how much money labels toss(ed) at mediocrity and then it finds a sizeable audience. Never seen a band fit the bill of poseur so well.

A friend just saw the BJM. He told me how Anton spent 15 minutes yelling at the drummer and then stormed off. I said "isn't that what people in the audience wanted to see the most?"

Dislike all of the music featured.

Dandy Warhols seem like relatively normal people who are a little fried by drugs and try slightly too hard to be "alternative", while most of BJM come off as genuine freaks who you wonder manage to feed themselves, let alone bring their shit together enough to make albums and go on tours. Don't like the music of either one but I'd last maybe five minutes with the latter before wanting to take a swing at somebody.

joe_lmr wrote: Sun Oct 22, 2023 4:14 pm Don't like the music of either one but I'd last maybe five minutes with the latter before wanting to take a swing at somebody.

Yeah this movie is an interesting personality assessment. Do you side more with the relatively 'normal' Dandys and think BJM are annoying fuckups, or think the DHs were a calculated corporate band while Newcombe and Co, while frustrating and flawed, are true 'artists'.

I was in the former category but it's been ages since I saw (and cringed at) it.

When I first saw Dig! I didn't know much about either band. I took an immediate liking to Brian Jonestown Massacre and an immediate dislike to the Dandy Warhols. I feel the same way today. The scene with Anton's parents is pretty heartbreaking.

I saw BJM live around 2007. Anton did his usual schtick, stopping the songs and starting over etc. for the first 15 minutes or so. It kind of felt perfunctory, like he was giving the crowd a little show. Then they played two solid hours of absolutely killer rock and roll, climaxing in a long feedback meltdown. Still one of the best concerts I've seen.

One of my favorite movies ever. Mrs MSE and I watch it once a year, never disappoints.

penningtron wrote: Sun Oct 22, 2023 4:43 pm Do you side more with the relatively 'normal' Dandys and think BJM are annoying fuckups, or think the DHs were a calculated corporate band while Newcombe and Co, while frustrating and flawed, are true 'artists'.

I've been team Dandys since the first time I saw it back when it came out. I never got the "Anton is a genius!" thing at all, neither has anyone else I know. BJM are fine, it's pleasant music, but I just don't hear the genius. And imagine being in a band with Anton. Jesus. I'd last 30 seconds.

I don't think I'd want to be in the Dandys either, but I never felt like they were some calculated corporate band, they seem like more or less regular old indie rockers+more drugs who got signed to a big label who didn't know what to do with them. I'm not too into most of their stuff, but after watching the movie for the billionth time, my wife was like "those Dandy Warhols songs are fucking catchy" and I couldn't disagree. I really love the 13 tales record, good songs front to back, interesting production, fun to strum along with. This one's my jam, they had the good sense to just stay on the one thing the whole time:

I saw Dig! a few times, and seen BJM live at least a half dozen times over the last quarter century.

I really like Dig! and I agree there’s a deliberate intent to make the Dandies look like a handled, packaged product and BJM look like the scrappy underdogs in a manner that probably exploits drug use and mental issues to suggest “misunderstood genius.” I think you have to watch the documentary knowing all that, but otherwise it’s an amazing opportunity to look into the trajectories of these two bands.

I think there was only one time I saw BJM be a total mess which was early 2000s, playing to like 100 people. It took like 30 minutes for them to set up, literally crawling around the stage trying to plug their shit in, false song starts, just kind of a bad vibe. But then they came by a year later and were totally pro and sounded great. Since then they’ve been well put together and drama-free. Those last couple records, Future is your Past and Fire Doesn’t Grow on Trees were pretty good although I did kinda drop the ball on what they were up to from like 2008-2020.

I always thought both bands were kinda in on the joke with this movie. Like, the feud is a hoax for the "doc". They all seemed like snot nosed little twerps and I don't like any of the music, and I like 60's Psych rock/nuggets stuff. BJM just do a really boring job of it. Like a dirty Oasis.

Kniferide wrote: Mon Oct 23, 2023 9:36 am I always thought both bands were kinda in on the joke with this movie. Like, the feud is a hoax for the "doc". They all seemed like snot nosed little twerps and I don't like any of the music, and I like 60's Psych rock/nuggets stuff. BJM just do a really boring job of it. Like a dirty Oasis.

So, about that...

I grew up on professional wrestling where nine and a half things out of ten were scripted.

Everything about this doc has that kind of a feel to it. Just no one as good at staying in character as George "The Animal..." Steele or The Wild Samoans used to be.