HoF.
This shit made my night.
HoF.
ok man, good luck. you have a place to hide so i'm sure you'll be fine.ChudFusk wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 8:47 pmHomie, it's already normalized in the form of war, policing, prison, capitol punishment, and limited access to healthcare, housing, food, and water. These are all things that can and do cause death, are socially accepted and legally sanctioned. While I believe that education and cross-cultural communication can improve some of our circumstances, there is no educating those whose livelihood and wealth depend on our exploitation and suffering. We aren't going to win over our oppressors by appealing to their compassion. Nothing is left but to either find a safe place to hide (which only the privileged can access) and look the other way while the misery continues), or to defend ourselves, or to die. I am lucky enough to have a place to hide, which is why I am not out merking the ruling class. But if you think that murder isn't already normalized and provided as a solution to many problems, then I have a bridge to sell you.eephus wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 6:41 pm If you think normalizing murder is some kind of balm or even solution for your very real suffering, I don't know what to tell ya.
I'll do you one better. Let's use way, way more cold-blooded examples than CEOs: Serial killers who sexually abuse and torture kids, then dismember them. Remorselessly and methodically, no insanity plea. In many states in this country, they would get the death penalty. Right?ChudFusk wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 5:49 pmI don't know why you can't tell the difference between indiscriminate slaughter and targeted, justified excution. If your point is that all death is bad, then I have bad news for you; we're all going to die. Some of us have a choice as to how and when, but it's people like this CEO who decide when countless others will lose access to life. As someone else said, killing people like that is a form of self-defense.OrthodoxEaster wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 5:37 pmAll of these killers —regardless of their target, regardless of whether their intent is noble or misguided — think they're killing b/c it's "right" and for a greater good.
OrthodoxEaster wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 5:37 pm B/c hey, why not gun down Bezos and Musk while we're at it, and the list goes on.
Again, if you can't tell the difference between state-sponsored execution (of people who far too often don't get a fair trial and are victims of racial discrimination) and a lone wolf vigilante cutting off one of the heads of the hydra, then maybe you are part of the problem.OrthodoxEaster wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 9:14 pmI don't care if the state or some vigilante ass is doing the killing.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. My point about having somewhere to hide is that I have privileges and resources that protect me from homelessness and poverty, so I have little motivation to give my freedom away by taking this sort of action. That doesn't mean it's wrong for someone else to do so, and if they actually have something to lose besides their lives then it is especially brave to make that sacrifice in service of the greater good.eephus wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 8:51 pmok man, good luck. you have a place to hide so i'm sure you'll be fine.
That was not the example I gave at all.ChudFusk wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 9:26 pmAgain, if you can't tell the difference between state-sponsored execution (of people who far too often don't get a fair trial and are victims of racial discrimination) and a lone wolf vigilante cutting off one of the heads of the hydra, then maybe you are part of the problem.OrthodoxEaster wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 9:14 pmI don't care if the state or some vigilante ass is doing the killing.
Not really. I just think murder is counterproductive. Whether it's by the state or by some vigilante, regardless of said vigilante's nobility or vileness.ChudFusk wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 10:14 pm So let's compare the number of white serial killers executed to the number of black men of questionable innocence; I'm sincerely interested in what that ratio is. Or better yet, let's stop comparing the use of violence by the state to violence by the individual because it's apples and oranges.
Yeah, but that's a little different. You're actively saving the kid. This is a bit more abstract. Did Gunman Smiley's actions directly save any lives or will they cause a huge policy change? I would be jumping up and down if they did but uh, they likely did not.ChudFusk wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 10:14 pmI don't think every individual should choose violence, but there are special circumstances. If someone was raping a child and I split their head open with a clawhammer, people would call me a hero.
But the state was founded on lots of other stuff as well. And a war is quite different and a much more complex issue than lone vigilante assassins or angry mobs, at least to me.ChudFusk wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 10:14 pmI think we agree that the state shouldn't have the power to kill, but the state's very existence is founded upon its ability to kill. We didn't fight the Revolutionary War with Nerf bats, and the cop who (justifiably) shot Ashli Babbitt while protecting the Capitol didn't do it with a Supersoaker. If the state can kill us, then we should be allowed to kill back, and the corporations are part of the state apparatus (and/or vice versa). And we should be the ones who decide if we are allowed to, even if the state says no.
Some people choose to be in the crosshairs. They almost always get away. Don't waste your energy.Gramsci wrote: Fri Dec 06, 2024 12:26 pm Yeah, I’m just trying to come up with reasons for people to not murder people.
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